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First Rights: Truly American trials of terrorism suspects

During the extensive coverage of the Bush administration's basic defeat in the so-called war crimes trial of Salim Hamdan, Attorney General Michael Mukasey was spared any mention of his June 4 assurance, before an audience of federal judges, that the forthcoming military commissions would be "in the best tradition of the American legal system."

As a voter, I want to know who John McCain and Barack Obama have in mind for their attorney general, because all three of Bush's chief law enforcement officials have enabled the incumbent president to do -- with regard to the Guantanamo Bay military commissions and much else -- what Justice Anthony Kennedy warned against in this year's Boumediene v. Bush decision, a ruling that restored habeas corpus rights to the prisoners at Guantanamo Bay:

"To hold that the political branches may switch the constitution on or off at will would lead to a regime in which they, not this court, say what the law is." By refusing to convict Hamdan of the most serious charges against him, the senior military officers on the jury at least partially concurred with Kennedy.

As Amnesty International said in response to the trial, it "revealed what is common knowledge -- the military commissions are fatally flawed and do not adhere to major aspects of the rule of law." American law!

To try terrorism suspects, we do not have to suspend due process and other fundamentals of American justice. The Human Rights First organization, based in Washington and New York, has attended nearly every military commission hearing, including Hamdan's, since they began in 2004. The next president, Congress and attorney general would be well-advised to read Human Rights First's current report, "In Pursuit of Justice: Prosecuting Terrorism Cases in the Federal Courts."

Two former federal prosecutors, Richard B. Zabel and James J. Benjamin Jr., have examined more than 120 international terrorism cases prosecuted right here -- in the criminal justice system and its courts -- during the past 15 years. They range, notes Human Rights First, "from epic mega-trials such as those involving the first attack on the world Trade Center (1993) and the East African embassy bombings (1998) to individual, pre-emptive prosecutions focused on prevention."

Zabel and Benjamin pored through motion papers, judicial opinions, trial detention procedures, rules for protecting classified evidence and the admissibility and authentication of evidence collected abroad. They also interviewed judges presiding over those terrorism cases, prosecutors and defense attorneys.

While the Bush administration is still trying to defend its crumbling Guantanamo Bay commissions, scheduling more trials to come as if there will be no elections in November, Zabel and Benjamin prove that the answer to whether our federal courts can effectively and fairly deal with terrorism cases "lies in the extensive record of actual prosecutions going back to the early 1990s and continuing to this day in federal courts around the country."

Among the report's findings that Bush's makeshift parallel court system can safely expire when he returns to Texas -- with no danger to national security -- are these results of their thorough investigative research:

"Prosecutors have invoked a host of specially tailored antiterrorism laws, as well as long-standing, generally applicable federal criminal statutes to obtain convictions in terrorism cases." And worth special attention in view of certain CIA secret interrogation practices authorized by the president since 2001 and further confirmed in a 2007 presidential executive order: Our federal courts, says Human Rights First, "have consistently exercised jurisdiction over defendants brought before them, even those defendants apprehended by unconventional or forcible means."

It has long been evident, however, that certain strong cases against defendants held by the CIA could not be brought to trial in our federal courts because of the lawless methods used to extract evidence from them. And that's why -- until rebuked several times by the Supreme Court -- the Bush administration tried to place their trials beyond American law at Guantanamo Bay.

Both at home and in our continuous global battle against ruthless jihadists, the integrity of our federal courts system is basic to how we represent ourselves to be as Americans. Although Mukasey might not agree, Human Rights First has preformed a patriotic service in its report.

Nat Hentoff is a nationally renowned authority on the First Amendment and the Bill of Rights.

(Aug. 20, 2008)

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The following are comments from the readers. In no way do they represent the views of the Hanford Sentinel

Scott Tucker wrote on Aug 20, 2008 1:05 PM:

" Again, another great article from Hentoff, proving once again that we don't have to stoop to the depths that some torture supporters would like us to in order to see that justice is served. Americans do not torture, at least the true Americans in this world. "

Sid wrote on Aug 20, 2008 1:34 PM:

" Osama bin Laden, of the "soverign nation of Al Queda", decalred WAR on the United States via his Fatwa which included bombing Kobar Towers, Two US embassy bombings, attack on the USS Cole and 9-11...killing innocent America citizens and others.

Sounds like war to me...

But the author here says non-American citizens just got "their" Habeas-Corpus rights "restored". How can they have "restored" what they never had?

(Same logic it's a budget "cut" when it wan't an increase in spending).

Clinton made this a "law enforcement" issue when it was considered WAR by those who kill our innocent civilians. The "wall" that his administration put into intelligence sharing was a major contributor to 9-11. PREVENTION of terroism is the goal, not how to PROSECUTE the terrorist AFTER they kill...

Lets give Bin Laden's "warriors" what THEY want after being captured: A warriors tribunal and/or imprisonment for the duration of the war as individually applicable.

This BS here is merely giving more lawyers more power, influence and paychecks far beyond what is common sense logical in wartime.

Prisoners of Al Queda are summarily executed. They don't get tribunals let alone Habeas Corpus rights.. "

dose wrote on Aug 20, 2008 1:42 PM:

" Hopefully Obama will ask John Edwards to be his attorney general. That dude will clean house and hopefully restore our Constitution that george bush thinks is just a piece of paper. "

WATCHDOG FRED wrote on Aug 20, 2008 11:13 PM:

" So what is the author and many of you saying? The guidelines by which we charge and prosecute our own military men/women is not a just hearing and judicial treatment? Then I would suggest the rewriting of the entire UCMJ at an added cost to taxpayers and that every man/woman who has ever been held for trial under this system and found guilty be immediately released. That should make some room in Leavenworth.
You foks are being rediculous, these are the same villians who plotted the death and destruction that took place on 9/11. Do you want to release a potential mastermind to further bring death and destruction to this country or do you want them held and punished before that opportunity presents itself?
Scott, what you have to say on the matter has little effect on you or Switzerland. Therefore I don't think any comments you might have would be substantial to the situation. It isn't Switzerland the terrorists are threatening to bomb and destroy, now is it? But should the American Embassy be taken out by terrorist, I understand you might lose some friends. You better start praying! "

Devils Advocate wrote on Aug 21, 2008 8:51 AM:

" War has something to do with justice? I thought war was saying, "We are going to kill you collectvely regardless of what your individual members or citizens have done." Which is why we don't put soldiers on trial after their countries surrender unless they've been involved in atrocities or taken actions outside the parameters of "civilized warfare." "

Scott Tucker wrote on Aug 21, 2008 3:01 PM:

" Freddy, You are right. Switzerland isn't a major target for terrorists, which means that they must be doing something right. You are also right that my comments on the Hanford Sentinel website, a newspaper located in HANFORD, CALIFORNIA, USA will have little effect on me or Switzerland (duh!). But, as my parents, brothers, and numerous friends do live in Hanford, I hope that my comments will have some effect on their well-being and safety. That is why I write in this forum, so that I can be sure that they don't only have your rubbish to read on a daily basis. "

Sid wrote on Aug 22, 2008 10:06 AM:

" Comrade Tucker,

Switzerland will never likely be a terrorist target in comparison to the US due to:

-Terrorists need SOMEWHERE to put/manage their money for operations. Nothing like the Swiss banking system! Just ask the Nazis...

- Switz. is mostly a homogeneous society and a small one at that, especially when compared to the US

- It can't ever compare to the "Great Satan" both in size, economic and military power, and jealosy of those nations "less fortunate".

- It doesn't have a Hollywood producing objectionable products for world-wide distrobution and hate-developing

Switzerland has a much lower profile than the US. It also does nothing in the leadership realm of nations either.

With apologies to Spiderman, "With great power comes great responsibility" "

WATCHDOG FRED FINALLY A DIRECT ANSWER wrote on Aug 22, 2008 10:52 AM:

" To: Scott Tucker wrote on Aug 21, 2008 5:01 PM:

" Freddy, You are right. Switzerland isn't a major target for terrorists.
You could have stopped your comments right here Scott. Your comment are welcome by someone I am sure. But if you think you are going to save the world from Switzerland, that is what the Austrian born Adolph Hitler thought as well. Oh doesn't Austria border Switzerland was not Switzerland one of Hitler's recreational sites during WWII, because of it's neutrality?

Switzerland isn't doing anything right Scott, they just haven't angered any muslims yet? There time is coming you can rest assured. That's what you Democrats don't understand there is no bargaining with them. They want all infadels removed from the earth. That is their goal and that is their plan as terrorists representing only one country, the country of unified hate and discontent with all other faiths. That is who and what they represent. "

Dandre wrote on Aug 22, 2008 6:25 PM:

" The Supreme Court upheld the rights of those people.
The phrase used by our founders was 'We the People of the United States'.
NOT 'We the Citizens ....'
ALL PEOPLE are born with these basic rights and OUR UNCORRUPTED justice system, though not perfect, has handled things fairly well, up until now.
The Military Lawyers involved in these proceedings have shown that they don't want to be part of this mess, their comments have been telling.
Scared children shouldn't play with the Constitution!
God Bless America! "

Dandre wrote on Aug 22, 2008 6:36 PM:

" All terrorist groups eventually end. But how do they end? The evidence since 1968 indicates that most groups have ended because (1) they joined the political process (43 percent) or (2) local police and intelligence agencies arrested or killed key members (40 percent). Military force has rarely been the primary reason for the end of terrorist groups, and few groups within this time frame have achieved victory. This has significant implications for dealing with al Qa'ida and suggests fundamentally rethinking post-9/11 U.S. counterterrorism strategy: Policymakers need to understand where to prioritize their efforts with limited resources and attention. The authors report that religious terrorist groups take longer to eliminate than other groups and rarely achieve their objectives. The authors conclude that policing and intelligence, rather than military force, should form the backbone of U.S. efforts against al Qa'ida. And U.S. policymakers should end the use of the phrase “war on terrorism” since there is no battlefield solution to defeating al Qa'ida.

The above was autored by a CONSERVATIVE 'think tank' "

Sid wrote on Aug 22, 2008 8:45 PM:

" Dandre says here:

"" The Supreme Court upheld the rights of those people.
The phrase used by our founders was 'We the People of the United States'.
NOT 'We the Citizens ....'
ALL PEOPLE are born with these basic rights..."

Comrade, you are contradicting yourself inside this short diatribe or don't you see it?

Terrorists in question are NOT US Citizens...

As YOU said above "We the people of the UNITED STATES..."

The you say "ALL PEOPLE ARE BORN WITH THESE RIGHTS"...

But all people ARE NOT US CITIZENS

Grab a hold of something quick and hang on! I think you are approaching escape velocity... "

WATCHDOG FRED DIDNT REALIZE wrote on Aug 23, 2008 8:07 AM:

" Scott Tucker wrote on Aug 21, 2008 5:01 PM:
But, as my parents, brothers, and numerous friends do live in Hanford, I hope that my comments will have some effect on their well-being and safety.

I apologize, I was working from the concept your parents, brothers and numerous friends had minds of their own and could speak for themselves. I had no idea you were the key note speaker of your DNA. "

Dandre wrote on Aug 23, 2008 11:55 AM:

" Sid
the founders concluded ALL PEOPLE are BORN with INALIENABLE rights, not just US citizens. Their ‘Liberal Experiment’ defined the LIMITATIONS on government, in direct contrast to the ‘authoritarian’ CONSERVATIVE monarchies they fled.
I don't have to hold on to anything to understand the LIBERAL intentions of this Countries Founders, it's you dittoheads looking like a constipated rush trying to distort the Constitution to justify republican crimes.
Proceeding with the renditions, black prisons and torture under the assumption the ‘permanent’ majority and their supreme court would cover their crimes, has exposed the criminals to possible international prosecution.
Rumsfeld and condi have already come close to being presented with warrants.

The RADICAL opinion the United States could trash habeas corpus and the Geneva Conventions have proven to be too much for that supreme court and the jags dealing with this cesspool.
So the administration is stuck with the dilemma of how to un-rendition and un-black prison PEOPLE that the supreme court has said were ILLEGALLY deprived of their INALIENABLE rights. The ‘smoke screen’ of dittohead ignorance and hysteria is their only hope. They love you sid!

Implying that these legal opinions are only coming from Liberals is also naive. "

ALEJANDRO wrote on Aug 23, 2008 6:40 PM:

" Duane Andre says:
'We the People of the United States' as if that includes anyone on U.S. soil that passes 'Go.'

OK, Duane, then you support NOT giving rights to "We the People of Mexico" for example - you know, those individuals who fly the Mexican Flag and are explicitly NOT the 'People of the United States' as you say.

Great call Duane . . . good insight.

Thanks for finally seeing the light as a true patriot should! "

WATCHDOG FRED wrote on Aug 24, 2008 12:14 PM:

" To Duane Dandre - the people's Savior from itselt.
Do you honestly feel that you can set at the keyboard and with your chums create the feasability to redistribute the wealth in this country? Because every blog you initiate seems to have this idea infused in it somewhere in your argument. Your jealousy of the earning capacity of someone like Rush is so evident ever since the blog concerning his new contract hit the blog site. Get over it, Duane Andre you will never have the earning capacity of a Rush.
You cannot legislate through people like NOBama the redistribution of his income. NObama wants to raise the taxes of anyone making 32K a year or more, I would say you fall into that category as an educated guess. So a vote for NObama will be a vote for higher taxes.
Your choice to portray America as the bad guy all the time is beginning to wear thin, from someone who swears to have worn one of her military uniforms. You must hate yourself for doing that with all the hate and anger you display toward the country that has provided everything you have. "

WATCHDOG FRED wrote on Aug 24, 2008 12:18 PM:

" To Duane Dandre - the people's Savior from itselt.
Had you toiled your however many decades you claim in Russia you would not have the money, freedom or property you now claim as yours. Everything there is and always will be owned by the government including it's people. You wouldn't be raising your children in a free society, nor your grandchildren. So offer me a better alternative to our government and we can discuss it, but so far there is no other model that has had the success of providing so much freedom to so many people. Switzerland even has it's trash police, so don't go there on me either.
This is and always will be the best damn country there is to live in and you know that, you may lose track of it, but deep down inside you know it. Otherwise like Scott you wouldn't be here. "

WATCHDOG FRED THE LIGHTER SIDE wrote on Aug 24, 2008 10:33 PM:

" To anyone who cares to listen: I don't recall seeing this guy in my sea bag or in the Navy Blue Jacket's Manual when I was in the service: Habeas Corpus "

WATCHDOG FRED STOP AND THINK wrote on Aug 25, 2008 9:51 AM:

" To All the Nay-sayers and America haters. I must point out if you lived in any land but this one, you would not be allowed the freedom to get on this blog day after day and complain about the big bad Americans. Further, freedoms of speech, freedom to travel anywhere within the United States without special papers and government approval, just doesn't happen anywhere else but here. Doubt it try Europe, for instance.
You all complain with disdain the country who offers you freedoms not known in third world countries. Out government which is the primary topic has proven itselt to be better than any other for religous and political freedoms.
So as you complain please don't forget those gallant and valant soldiers airmen and marines who have made your dreams possible. This country has always believed in a strong military and that is what have kept our shores free from attack from December 7, 1941 to September 11, 2001. It is also what has kept it safe since then. So as you pass NAS Lemmore you might want to hang out a sign that says; Thanks for your service. Thank Guardsman? "

jeff wrote on Aug 25, 2008 10:11 AM:

" Fred, the Swiss used to do something right. They built Volvo’s, perhaps the best car manufacturer ever until they sold to the American car company Ford.

When the government of a society is allowed to perform actions that are considered illegal for its citizens the society has collapsed. You should read “The Law’ by Frederic Bastiat and before you comment on something you know nothing about. If the man were alive today he would be a conservative Republican. It’s a good read and you can find it on the internet easily. "

WATCHDOG FRED NOT IN TUNE TO TODAY wrote on Aug 25, 2008 3:48 PM:

" The author you present and his calculations take into account the entire country of France in which 36 million was the population. In california today there are 35 million people alone, not counting the other 49 states. There is no possible comparison to the scenarios. Although ahead of htis time the author still is not in tune to the 2008 beat of today.

You should read “The Law’ by Frederic Bastiat "

WATCHDOG FRED wrote on Aug 25, 2008 3:55 PM:

" jeff wrote on Aug 25, 2008 12:11 PM:

" Fred, the Swiss used to do something right. They built Volvo’s, perhaps the best car manufacturer ever until they sold to the American car company Ford.

I wouldn't know, I've only owned one foreigh car in my lifetime and it was a 1973 Volkswagon Super Beetle, but the best little rear engine car I ever owned was a 1960 corvair which never rolled over on me like Ralph Nader claimed it would. He put a good car out of the market on bullcrap. "

WATCHDOG FRED wrote on Aug 25, 2008 3:55 PM:

" jeff wrote on Aug 25, 2008 12:11 PM:

" Fred, the Swiss used to do something right. They built Volvo’s, perhaps the best car manufacturer ever until they sold to the American car company Ford.

I wouldn't know, I've only owned one foreigh car in my lifetime and it was a 1973 Volkswagon Super Beetle, but the best little rear engine car I ever owned was a 1960 corvair which never rolled over on me like Ralph Nader claimed it would. He put a good car out of the market on bullcrap.

Do you know how many mice they had to kill in order to prove a corvair was unsafe? "

ALEJANDRO wrote on Aug 25, 2008 5:15 PM:

" Oh, well...I didn't know this:

"Fred, the Swiss used to do something right. They built Volvo’s, perhaps the best car manufacturer ever until they sold to the American car company Ford."

Don't tell Sweden that Switzerland builds their car!

Wait, let's ask Scott...

Priceless, ladies and gentlemen. "

Sid wrote on Aug 26, 2008 4:41 AM:

" Comrade Dandre,

Tell Hugo Chavez, Kim Jong Il, Vladamir Putin, the current bunch of thugs that run mainland China that ALL PEOPLE are born with "inaliable rights"...

They run such socialist utopias that you crave the US to become. There are laws and rules to manage our society. Immigration laws included. Socialists only obey the ones that they "like" or not obey the ones they don't like, including those of immigration, as it furthers their "logic".

As far as the Fonding Fathers, they knew what they wrote would ONLY effect the US should the revolution become sucessful...

They, in the 1770=1780's never thought someone from 2008 would interpret their words in a such a "liberal" fashion saying that THEY were promoting world-wide socialism... "

The Anti Right Winger wrote on Aug 26, 2008 4:55 PM:

" Sid wrote on Aug 26, 2008 6:41 AM:
They, in the 1770=1780's never thought someone from 2008 would interpret their words in a such a "liberal" fashion

Throughout the 19th century, the two major political traditions in America offered authentically different views on the proper roles of government. The classical liberals, typified by Thomas Jefferson early on, had their political outlet in the Democratic Party, which, for the most part, stood on the side of limited, constitutional government and individual rights. Those who believed in a strong central government, typified early on by Alexander Hamilton, found their political home first in the Federalist Party, then in the Whig Party, and then in the Republican Party, which openly embraced the doctrine of big government throughout the 19th century.

Sid it seems your point that none of the founding fathers embraced big government is without merit. "

dose wrote on Aug 26, 2008 5:02 PM:

" Sid proves once again that even though republicans like to use the word socialist almost as much as mccain likes to say pow he has no idea what a socialist is. Cuba, Venezuela, North Korea, and China are not soicalist countries Sid, they are communist dictatorships. Please try again. "

Dandre wrote on Aug 26, 2008 6:11 PM:

" "As Mankind becomes more liberal, they will be more apt to allow that all those who conduct themselves as worthy members of the community are equally entitled to the protections of civil government. I hope ever to see America among the foremost nations of justice and liberality."

George Washington


They KNEW that this Country would affect the world, sid, and the despots you list are geo bushes 'ideal'.
The Constitution has been under attack by these same neo-thugs since watergate and they rely on the ignorance of an electorate that doesn't know the difference between types of conservatives, let along anything else political.
the 20th century saw 2 countries go to both extremes. Communist Russia the left extreme corrupted.
Nazism, the extreme right was working according to plan, sic heil, heir sid..... "

jeff wrote on Aug 27, 2008 8:13 AM:

" Yes Alejandro you are correct, Volvo was from Sweden not Switzerland. I made a mistake (See how easy it is to admit when you’re wrong Alex?). Fred, I doubt any mice were killed when testing the Corvair for oversteering problems. "

WATCHDOG FRED wrote on Aug 27, 2008 6:45 PM:

" Did anyone watch Bill Clinton's speach tonight? I wonder how NObama bought him and Hillary off? It will be interesting, Clinton stated he will tell the world after January what happened, whey there was a split and what brought it all back together again. We'll see if he can be anymore truthful about that than he was that woman? It will be fun to watch.

But I still say for the standing ovation he and Hillary received the Democrats picked the wrong candidates. She should have won and picked Bill for her Veep. Nothing says he can't be Vice President? He worked for Hillary the whole time he was president anyway. "

ALEJANDRO wrote on Aug 27, 2008 9:12 PM:

" What about America's right to have decent citizens? Civic minded individuals who we all can be proud of. This used to matter to our generations past.

Why is it that criminals and liberal progressive Democrats defend - and outright demand - the LEAST amount of punishment for any given crime?

...Don't taser anyone who is a threat ‘cause that might hurt them.
...Commit a crime and get free job training, rehab, and job placement at the taxpayer's expense.
...Illegal drugs should be declared legal and all be free to partake without consequences.

Several bloggers here focus on what they perceive to be human 'rights' and care not about human crime. To their way of thinking, the rights of the accused matter more than those of the victim(s). Terrorists/enemy combatants get to contest every minute technicality our justice system provides, just like local criminals do. Cracks in the armor of justice that allows a less than adequate punishment for deeds done. This is no deterrent, folks.

It is supposed to be feel-good & 'noble.'

Not for all of us . . . not even most of us. "

jeff wrote on Aug 28, 2008 7:55 AM:

" You’re right Fred what was I thinking. I’m sure he was using stunt mice to drive cars around. I mean you put 10 phone books on the seat they could at least see out the window I wonder how he made it so they could power the gas, clutch and breaks though. "

The Anti Right Winger wrote on Aug 28, 2008 4:56 PM:

" Alejandro Wrote: "Terrorists/enemy combatants get to contest every minute technicality our justice system provides, just like local criminals do. Cracks in the armor of justice that allows a less than adequate punishment for deeds done."

Alejandro justice is at the heart about rights. The governments right to accuse and the individuals right to defend themselves against that accusation.

It may surprise you that many of us to the left of you politically are just as strong supporters of stiff punishments for crimes. The difference is that we believe that tyranny is best prevented by a free and fair examination of the evidence.
History is full of tyrants who ruled by intimidation since no one had the right to question the government if they imprisoned someone for any reason they saw fit.

"Once a government is committed to the principle of silencing the voice of opposition, it has only one way to go, and that is down the path of increasingly repressive measures, until it becomes a source of terror to all its citizens and creates a country where everyone lives in fear."

-Harry S Truman "

our Supreme Court wrote on Aug 28, 2008 9:41 PM:

" We have one of the best Supreme Courts ever. Bush picked several true winners and they and this Court don't always vote for Bush just because he chose them if you haven't noticed. Bush hasn't hurt any of our Constitutional rights unless you ARE a criminal trying to hide something. Bush has made mistakes no question, but if Obama, Gore, or Kerry were in office when we had the 9/11 hit we would still be getting attacked every week since they are weak on military and weak on crime. I despise Bill Clinton, but he would easily win again if he could run. He is an incredible speaker and Obama isn't even close on his best day, not even remotely close. Obama really has nothing to offer except Bill and Hillary's ideas which didn't work during their 8 years in office. Come on, Bush got 8 years because of the mess the Clintons left us. I must vote Republican because Obama has nothing to offer and his views would hurt my Constitutional rights given that he is against the 2nd Amendment and favors international laws over our own Constitution. "

Sid wrote on Aug 28, 2008 9:49 PM:

" Hello all,

dose/Dandre/ARW/Comrades, please explain what the difference is between a communist and a socialist. I would LOVE to be enlightened by ones who apparently from actual practise know the difference...

Dandre, amazing how you can extrapolate the 1770's with 2008 in that the founding fathers KNEW-KNEW mind you(!) that what they were doing had "world-wide" in mind... (My you are clarvoiant to what they "knew" are you not? Or is that YOUR interpretation. Quite different things you know...)

Do you think, just maybe, that GW that you quoted might have ment if we did one thing, that the world might CHOOSE, if LIKE ENLIGHTENED to follow in emulation? He also said the US shouldn't have any foreign alliances to bog it down or obligate it to other nations...recall that one?

Pleae recall that the US had it's first major miliary build-up in world-wide power with President Jefferson, the liberal so many bring up. A 18th century liberal is a 21st century "neo-con" perhaps?

Placing a 2008 context to a 18th century one is kinda hard OR too easy (if you merely cut & paste)isn't it? "

Scott Tucker wrote on Aug 28, 2008 11:03 PM:

" Dear Anti Right Winger, Nicely stated! "

ALEJANDRO wrote on Aug 30, 2008 3:37 PM:

" Scott Tucker and The Anti Right Winger espouse the oh-so-liberal ‘lets just all be fair' doctrine as their usual modus operandi.

What is ‘justice' anyway?

WordNet: A lexical database for the English language - Cognitive Science Laboratory at Princeton University - best defines it as:

[justice, justness]
"... The quality of being just or fair"

and

[justice]
"... (The) Judgment involved in the determination of rights and the assignment of rewards and punishments."


On the battlefield, in times of conflict, and in the markets, malls, restaurants, and airports where suicide bombers and snipers ply their trade, the innocent victims perhaps would have a different slant on the liberal's ‘determination of rights and the assignment of rewards' I'll wager.

That's why we have civilian justice separate from military justice.

Once again, there is no one single perfect definition of what justice really is.

And in reading the second definition given above, it really is a judgement call. "




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